Megan Ernst Wittenberg, Scientific Illustrator

Megan Ernst Wittenberg is a lifelong Central Area resident. She shares her thoughts on her past and the history of the area. 

Megan Ernst Wittenberg. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

We’re interviewing Megan Ernst Wittenberg about her experiences in the Central Area. You grew up here?

(Nodding, laughs) I guess I can’t just nod. I was born in the Mount Baker neighborhood a few blocks from Franklin School.

We lived right off of Rainier Ave., by the high school. It definitely had a different feel from the Mt. Baker homes in the hills. Just like the valley is different from the hills in Madrona or by the lakeside. These neighborhoods used to be similar when I was little, (laughs) but it’s not any longer.

It’s changed economically?

Oh, yes.

When we moved over here (to Madrona) we lived two blocks up from Lake Washington. Our house was just up from what we called the T-Dock, half way between the Madrona swimming beach and the Marina. This whole area was redlined at that time. The banks weren’t loaning money to people (of color). It was just everybody living together; it was more working class with more racial diversity.

T-Dock, side view. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

It was 1969 when we moved into that neighborhood. Even after Open Housing our neighbors didn’t change for roughly 20 years. When I went off to college, some people were starting to sell their houses and different people were trying to move in, but overall our neighborhood was very, very much the same.

How would you describe your neighborhood composition then?

Ours was definitely a mix. There was a large African American/Filipino family. There were white families; there were Jews. There were two houses that had gay male couples. There were elderly people, single women and older couples. It was a huge mix of people with more people of color than white people.

I’m still in contact with about 15 people from the neighborhood who I grew up with.

Do you know that park at 36^th and Terrace? That’s where I grew up. If you’re at that lookout where the stairs are, down those stairs to the left are two houses. That’s where I lived.

The park is where the Italian Embassy was; it was a house with a huge ballroom. It was next to another house. The lady who lived there donated her property to the city. The embassy building just got really run down. They decided to sell to the city or give it… So, those two parcels became the park.

We grew up in the hill and played in those woods.

There were there a lot of empty lots when you grew up?

Not empty lots; the back yards were woods. All of those houses have back yards that were wooded from 36^th Ave. to Randolph Ave. which is the next street down. It was woods, nobody cared, and so we just ran through those woods. It runs for two blocks along there. Now, a few houses have been built up into those woods but back then it was open. All the kids just ran through the woods all day.

Mt. Rainier from Madrona Beach.  Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

I don’t know if people do that anymore.

Yeah, I don’t think so. For one thing, in that whole neighborhood on Randolph Ave., there are zero children. The original houses were bought by people who then replaced them with these huge houses and don’t have kids.

It sounds like your neighborhood was interesting, I’d been told that once you get past 34^th it was really white. Yet, it sounds like your street was demographically much more like anywhere else on the rest of the Central District.

From 1969 until ‘82 I would say it was probably about 50/50 people of color. Certainly, it was starting to gentrify but that was going fairly slowly. That was because families had been there for a long time and they owned their houses outright. They weren’t going anywhere (laughs). Even then, some of the people who moved in were African American. One little run-down house was bought and built up into a fancy place behind a gated driveway. We (the neighbors) were like, what is that! (laughs)

 Overlooking Lake Washington. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Today of course, there are many homes there worth millions of dollars. Yet, there are two houses still owned by the original people; they are African American. Everybody else has moved. All the smaller houses were bought and fixed up, torn down, or redone. One family bought two houses plus a property, and so they have a compound and it’s very fancy now. When I go back to visit, there is one woman who still lives there.

When I moved into my house here in the Madrona Valley 20 years ago, there were still African Americans on 35^th Ave. and even a bit further. A Judge still lives there.

There was a time in the late 60s when letter bombs were a thing so we always had to keep our eyes open to make sure that nobody came to his house that we didn’t recognize. If we saw a strange person around his house, we would say something. This Judge who lived on 37^th Avenue was an African American and his mailbox was blown up. Nobody was hurt but it was kind of scary.

Cherry Tree. Detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Who was suspected?

I don’t know. I was young then… nobody really knew who was doing it. There was tension at that time and it was clearly directed at prominent African Americans.

Generally, the white people who lived on that side of the hill were fairly liberal hippies fighting for social justice. At least the white people that I knew. I don’t think there were a whole lot of people living in this neighborhood at that time who were just like, “We’re rich businessmen, we’re Republicans.” (laughs)

The people like that left during White Flight, and the people who stayed - stayed because these were their homes and these were their neighbors.

Where did you go to school?

The Seattle School District even then was crazy. I went to Madrona (Elementary) for kindergarten, and then they changed it to late Elementary, for 3^rd to 6^th or something, and I never went there again. I went to what was then called Harrison (Elementary), and became Martin Luther King Elementary for 1^st grade. Then, they changed the boundaries and so then I went to Leschi (Elementary) for 2^nd and 3^rd grade. Next, my mom had gotten a job at The Bush School as the librarian and so I attended there for 4^th, 5^th and 6^th grade. By 6^th grade, all of the kids figured out who was rich and who wasn’t, and it became fairly unbearable for me (laughs) because I was one of the staff members’ kids.

Madrona Elementary. Collection: Jack Dunn

I begged my mom to let me go back to public school, so I went to Meany (Jr. High) for two years, and Garfield (High) for four. So, I went to school all over the place.

You had a full gamut of the school experience, from private to public and from hither and yon. Were you happy in school? What do you most remember about Junior High?

Junior High was great. I had just come from 6^th grade at the Bush School, which was horrible for me; I didn’t fit in. Meany was huge, there were lots of people to choose from and you can find your group of friends. I liked my teachers. I was very relieved and happy to be there. Then, Garfield was awesome for me. I loved Garfield.

Meany Jr. High. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

What kind of people did you gravitate towards?

I’m kind of a science nerd. (laughs) I was there when Mr. Craig MacGowan was there. He was a teacher who started programs for (science) field trips and the Marine Biology program. He’s really the one who made Garfield into the science magnet that it is. He was really a terrific teacher for me. So much so, that I’m still a little involved with the science program at Garfield.

You were in high school roughly within the late 70s or 80s?

Yes, 1979 through ‘82.

What was the tenor at Garfield at that time?

Well, they started (desegregation) busing then. In fact, I was supposed to be bused to Ingraham. I petitioned to go to Garfield ‘cause I wanted Marine Biology. I can’t imagine what it was like for the African Americans from this community that were bused to Ingraham. When we played Ingraham High (for football) I was called names. I thought, “this is the 1980s, I didn’t know people still said that.”

Garfield High Door.  Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Racist comments?

Oh, yes, racist. I was shocked.

At that time at Garfield, it was also the beginning of some of the troubles because they started having the AP programs. These programs were pulling people from different places. These magnet programs were creating a bit of a divide.

I think it made a difference when everybody was still all together (in classes). It was still majority African American. I don’t know what the ratio is now but then it was 60 or 70% African American. Since I was a science nerd the majority of my friends then were white.

Garfield High Yearbook. 1982

Then, when I started working on Garfield reunions that entirely changed. The people that I do the reunion stuff with are majority African American. Now, we’re totally connected. It feels like we’re a part of the same team.

So there is a feeling of community that didn’t exist in the same way when you were actually in school?

We still came from the same place. We still know the same things. I mean, maybe it’s sort of a sentimentality, or I don’t know what it is, but there was a little of a more divide, back during high school. Although, it depended on who you were, if you were in sports, for instance, there wasn’t that divide.

That’s interesting. Do you think that’s because the area has changed so much that differences mean less than the fact that you shared an experience and a time?

Yeah, the fact that we all went to Garfield is more important than the fact that I was kind of nerdy while someone else was a basketball star.

Garfield High Yearbook. 1982

Did your parents grow up here as well?

Not in the Central Area, no.

In Washington (State)?

My mom grew up in Puyallup. My dad went to a high school in Tacoma. He was a son of a Methodist Minister so they had to move every few years to a different church in Centralia, in Wenatchee…

…but they are Washingtonians?

Yes. His mom moved to Seattle in 1912. And my great-great grandpa moved here when he was 22.

Your family is long-time Washingtonians.

Yes.

Did your family go to a Methodist church when you were growing up?

I guess I would say that my immediate family was more Unitarian. We went to a University District Unitarian Church. We weren’t a regular church-goers. Not really.

My uncle had a church here for years, and my grandpa had retired. I don’t remember him as a minister. My uncle’s daughter is also a minister. She also had a church here for a long time as well as other miscellaneous uncles and…(laughs). There’s a lot of ministers in my family.

Washington Coast. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

When we get together, every 4th of July at my uncle’s house, there’s sometimes as many as seven ministers (laughs).

So your parents were a little bit outliers in that…they chose a different church.

Yeah. My dad was a hippie and definitely anti-organized religion. My mom liked the Unitarian Church because of the music. She was raised a Methodist too, but she met my dad at the University of Puget Sound which was a Methodist school… A lot of my family went there.

My dad left when I was five years old, just after the house was built. They bought property and built a house. My dad is an architect and he built the house. He left shortly after the house was done. He still lived in the neighborhood but not with us. That was all separate—whatever he was doing versus what we were doing.

That’s a tough age to have that happen… That’s hard. (pause)

Yeah, my brother was one and half so…

Maybe it was a little bit easier for him, actually.

Yes.

Do you have any particular memories of events at Garfield that sum up what it was like at that time? Beyond the name calling at…

The Communists started coming (laughs). When I was either a freshman or sophomore, they would come on May Day. We were all sitting outside eating lunch. They had leaflets that they were handing out and talking about ‘The Man’ and “We needed to fight against our Principal.” (laughs)

Garfield High. Architectural detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Our Principal was very popular, in general. So, the students started crumpling up the flyers and throwing them at the Communists. There was this huge shouting match. Then, they got pushed back. They had to be moved off of the campus. From then on, there was this rule that they couldn’t come onto the campus. They would be across the street. Every year after that, they would come on May Day and just like incite this little riot. It was just the weirdest thing (laughs). People would come running out and shout at them. Sometimes they chased them down the streets. (laughs)

I think they came to Garfield because of the Black Panthers and because it’d been such a hotbed of revolution. And, the 80s weren’t that. (laughs) They were sorely disappointed.

By the time you were growing up, all of that was already history?

The Black Panthers, yeah.

And the radicalism?

Yes.

The ‘80s were, I believe called the “Me Generation” wasn’t it? (laughs)

Still, my dad and my family in general we’re fairly very politically liberal. Well, my dad was more towards to the revolutionary side. They would have been good, law abiding revolutionaries (laughs) but revolutionary in their own right, I would say.

But none of that was happening at Garfield when I was there.

I remember when I was little the feeling of it (the radicalism); I don’t remember specific things. I used to walk to Madrona School and I went to preschool in the church (Madrona Grace Presbyterian) when the Black Panthers met there. There was also a preschool in there. The Black Panthers in my mind took care of kids so they weren’t a scary thing. I don’t have a scary thing attached to the memory of them.

So when I read stuff about all those guys standing with their guns, I think hmmm… (laughs)

Black Panther Party. Breakfast Program. Collection Aaron Dixon

That’s the interesting thing about Black Panthers here, because people who lived in this neighborhood, not always, but usually they felt they were a positive thing.

Also people felt positive about those who worked to create (Seattle's Gang of 4) El Centro de la Raza and all of that. Now my dad was involved in sort of reclaiming some of the Central Area. I have a button that has the picture of a bird, like it’s a bird shape, and it’s the outline of the area—the Central Area.

Model Cities?

Yes, during that they were trying to improve (the area). That’s when the Medger Evers (swimming pool) was built. My Dad was involved in the action to stop the tearing down of buildings in Pioneer Square. He helped save the buildings in Pioneer Square and the Pergola and other things.

Was he ever involved in Allied Arts? That’s what they work on too.

Model Cities. Collection Dorothy Cordova. FAHNS

I don’t know. He was pretty active and fighting for the area, I guess.

As an architect interested in urban planning that would have made a perfect sense to be involved in Model Cities.

What was the most fun you can remember from high school?

There are two things. First, I had a really great group of friends who I’m still in contact with and they’re still awesome. I did not choose poorly in high school (laughs). We did a lot of really fun things together. I was kind of a goody-two-shoes, naïve. A lot of my friends didn’t do drugs, but we did drive around a little too fast in our cars. We’d all cram into the car and stay out late. Compared to the trouble we could be getting into, well, none of us were drunk while we were driving around too fast, thankfully.

Yeah, I just really had fun. We decided that everybody got a surprise birthday party. It started with me on my 16^th birthday. It was so much fun that we decided that everybody had to have one. It was getting hard to make it very surprising by the end. They just didn’t know how, or when, or what it was going to be like.

Garfield High. Architectural detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Another fun thing was the marine biology field trips. I went to Hawai'i with Mr. MacGowan. We also went to eastern Washington, we went to the San Juan Islands. But then, Mr. MacGowan started these big, big field trips. He started going to Hawai'i, the Galapagos, to Africa, to New Zealand and Australia; just incredible field trips. That’s still happening, which is a part of what I’m still involved with. There’s a Mack Fund that was set up when he retired, and the money goes to fund the kids who wouldn’t otherwise be able to afford to go on a field trip. So everybody can apply.

They also have ways to raise money, like beach clean-ups.

Yeah, this area is a really a great place, geographically, to do Marine Biology. When they were doing beach clean-ups, was water quality vastly different back then to what it is now?

Well, we did find some pretty gross stuff, condoms, tampons… Occasionally we found a needle but I don’t feel like it was worse. In fact, when I go to Madrona beach now, there’re certainly a lot more algae and seaweed than I ever remember.

Madrona Beach. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

It’s been hot.

Yes, but every year Madrona beach is kind of gross. There’s old dead fish floating.

Really?

We never swam at Madrona beach. We swam off the T-Dock - that was entirely illegal. They didn’t care back then but of course now they care more.  

I don’t think there’s more garbage now. I think that there’s more regular clean up now. I noticed, for instance, all the lifeguards spend a lot of time doing exactly that. When they’re not on duty watching, I’ve seen them walk through and pick stuff up. I think they do more (of) that now than maybe they used to.

Madrona Lakeside. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

It’s better managed. Now everybody has a camera.

And you could be sued.

True. Did you stay in the area to go to college?

I went to Western (Washington University) in Bellingham.

Did you study Marine Biology?

That was my plan, but the Biology program there was so much more boring than Mr. McGowan’s classes (laughs). I didn’t stick with it. I couldn’t decide if I wanted to be a scientist or an artist, so I ended up going to Fairhaven, a college within Western, and writing my own degree. Later, I went to UW for their certificate program in Scientific Illustration. That’s what I ended up choosing.

Garfield High. Architectural detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

You combined interests.

Yeah. It was so nice because people think that those are things that can’t be compatible.

That’s too bad, because it is.

People think if you’re an artist then you’re not a scientist. If you’re a scientist then you can’t be an artist.

That’s too bad, because it’s not true at all.

Right.

That’s one of the great things about Coyote Central is they’re very clear. All of these things are problem solving; whether you’re writing code or doing animation; whether you’re making a sculpture or a dress… All of these things are problem solving, and that’s really true. It’s all creative work.

Coyote Central, Sandwich board.  Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Is your husband from here?

No, he’s from Indiana.

Where did you guys meet?

We met through his softball team in the Jewish JCC Softball League. A number of my friends from my synagogue (I had converted to Judaism) were on the same team with him and so I met him.

You had converted before you met him?

Yes.

I didn’t know that.

I would say that I’ve been on that path since I was little. Some of my memories from the neighborhood are of our Jewish neighbors who would bring us Hanukkah ‘gelt’ (golden chocolate coins). It was just the very littlest, little mention that there were Jewish holidays different than the Christian. Then, in high school, my best friend was Jewish. I got to ask him all these questions and he would just answer. He was just relaxed. It was great.  His attitude about it was just really open and relaxed.

Central District Church, former synagogue. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Was he from the Reform Synagogue?

He was bused, so he was up in Wedgewood. He went to (Temple) Beth Am. My friend took me on a date to JCC, to a young people’s Jewish event, a Fair or something. Definitely even in high school I was thinking about it. Then in college, I decided definitely that I was not Christian. I didn’t believe that Jesus was the Messiah. Then I had to figure out, “What am I?”  It wasn’t until I did convert that I started dating Alan. I was already going to the synagogue but I hadn’t fully converted yet.

I wanted to convert before we got married, because if we were going to have children, I wanted them to be Jewish.

Seattle Jews are fairly incorporated. There are pockets where there are Orthodox, who keep it more separate. You can live in Seattle and not really know that there’s any Jewish (culture) happening because the Jews are (and were) fairly invisible in some ways, compared to a lot of places.

Which is a bit a tragedy because the Jewish history in this community is absolutely fascinating.

Oh yeah, especially in this neighborhood.

I spoke to Mr. Richlen; he is really interesting. And I interviewed someone who is Anonymous from the Sephardic community. It’s a really interesting almost hidden history here, and it’s fascinating…

Yeah, some of the buildings that are still up are old synagogues. Many things like that, people just have no idea.

The origins of the Tolliver Church, the performing arts building, so much architecturally interesting history, and a lot of very incredibly successful people, too, came from that community: The Seligs, the Masins, the Alhadeffs…

Tolliver Temple, former synagogue. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Langston Hughes Performing Arts Center, former synagogue. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Anyway, you started moving towards Judaism when you were in high school, and you met your husband after college?

Oh, yeah. I was 40…

I am fairly spiritual in a way. I mean that it seems important to me. Partially it’s because of my background; I think it’s in my genes (laughs).

There are studies published showing some things are handed down in your genes. I just think that spiritual study has been handed down in my family. My family is very religious and spiritual. The Spirit, and not the Word, those kind of Christians. They wouldn’t say this is in the Bible so you have to… they believe in the story of it and the feelings of love.

Jumping backwards a bit, when did you move back to the area?

Right after college, I moved back to Seattle and lived in Wallingford. I rented a house with a group of friends. I was dating somebody at the time who got this great job offer in Massachusetts and he wanted me to move there. I was like, “I can’t. I’m not going to…” He said, “If you love me, you’d move.” And I said, “If you love me, you’d stay.”

It goes both ways (laughs). I realized that I was not going to be leaving. It was a second time that I had a really good offer to move and be with someone. And I was like, “I’m not, not going do it, it’s not going to happen.” Then, I decided when I was 30 that I wanted to buy a house, and that’s when I bought this house (in Madrona). That was 20 years ago.

You bought it on your own?

Yes.

What was the neighborhood like then?

It was still very similar to how it was when I grew up. When I moved in white people were the minority on this street. It was changing; it was just starting to definitely change. There were a whole bunch of grandmas—African American grandmas that lived on this street. They all had grandchildren who lived with them. Some of it was good—we had great relationships, and some of it ---like in one case where the grandchildren were clearly taking advantage, and everything was getting run down. And the grandma had nothing…

Madrona Valley. Night. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Then by the time grandma died it was all paid off. The house was free and clear but after the grandma died, these grandkids just ran it into the ground… They didn’t pay any of the taxes. It was taken away from them. It was heartbreaking; it is heartbreaking.

It was sold on the sheriff auction to a person who flipped it. Did a beautiful job.  After that house got sold, there were three empty lots that got built on. People started selling the houses for quite a bit of money.

One house sat empty and the kids tried to sell it for a bit of money, but by then it didn’t have plumbing. There were cats and rats living in it. They were really mad that they couldn’t capitalize on it.

The whole thing to me, was heartbreaking because their grandparents had worked very hard for that house - to have it just fall into nothing… There were other houses where they all decided to move to California. The house was in good shape, and the grandkids and the grandma worked together…

So they were able to profit from the incredible sweat labor and the initial investment?

Yes.

I’m sure you know, this city at one time had the highest percentage of black homeownership in the country. A certain percentage of those families were able to capitalize on that and some weren’t...

I would say that the majority did, yes, the majority did. There were, though, two houses here that were particularly sad.

It’s sad. It wasn’t easy for the people who originally bought those houses, how difficult it was to do they had worked for it.  When all that is lost, it’s heartbreaking.

That’s true.

Garfield High. Architectural detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

So you were here as a single person?

Yes.

Did the neighborhood feel safe?

Absolutely.

I had been living in Wallingford. Wallingford, fancy right? I kind of knew the neighbors, the people directly next door to us. But other than that, people didn’t talk to each other and I just… I couldn’t stand it. 

When I was going to buy a house, I had this very small area that I allowed my realtor to even look in. He said, “You know this would be easier if you’d open it up.” I’m said, “No, this is where I want to live. If it takes me all year, I would rather take the time and find the house that I want to live in, maybe for the rest of my life. My borders were drawn from Madison (St.) to Jackson (Ave.) and from 34^th to 19^th (Avenues). I knew this is where I wanted to live.

And we found it. Within two weeks moving in here, almost every person on the block introduced themselves to me. I was just like, “I am so home!” (laughs) “Oh my God, this is what I’ve been wanting.” You know, I was friends with everybody; I am friends with everybody on the street. Everybody.

When I tell people from DC or New York City, that I know most of the people within a couple of blocks, or I’ve at least spoken to them, people are shocked ‘cause that doesn’t seem to happen elsewhere in cities. That’s one of the things I love about this neighborhood.

Oh, yeah. I’ve had people, friends on Facebook, complaining that they wish they could find a village. I’m thinking, “Yeah, that’s pretty much what I have here. This neighborhood is a village, with all of the kids… When my son was born, he was the 21^st kid on this block. The 21^st kid! A lot of them have since gone off to college; it has changed since.

Garfield High. Architectural detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

Everybody lets their kids just run out and play. I’ve let my son go out when the big boys are playing basketball. He can just go out and play with all of the kids. I know that he can go into any house here and he’ll be taken care of – That was what I knew too when I was a kid.

In a lot of places in this country where the children are sort of like prisoners, they’re taken from place to place. They’re never allowed to just run down the street alone and play.

Yeah. When Alan and I got married, we had a big discussion because the general consensus is when two households are merging that you should get a new home, so that one person isn’t moving into another person’s territory. He moved in here before we got married and lived here for a year. He really came to appreciate that there wasn’t going to be a better neighborhood.

This house has everything we need, and you can’t, you cannot beat this community. Still, he would like a garage. But a garage just not worth giving up this community, we decided to stay.

It’s really great that children play together in the streets here.

I’m so glad that my child gets to go to Madrona Elementary. The community there is exactly what I was hoping for, for him. You know, as a white person in Seattle now, it is harder to have people-of-color friends. It’s a very separate sort of city.

If you look at my friends, if I have a party at my house, it’s going to be a majority of white people.  Yet, when it’s my son’s birthday it’s not because he goes to the school in Madrona.

To me still, the things that I learned from growing up in a mixed community are so invaluable. I wanted that for my son. I know it’s different even if your parents are liberal and they teach you that skin color doesn’t matter, and that everybody is equal. Still, it’s not the same as having a whole bunch of African American friends. You learn that some kids will become your best friend, some will threaten to beat you up, some will like science and some will like exactly the same things you do. Exactly the same. When you, in your soul, know this because you’ve experienced it, it’s entirely different to me than a book learning it, or…

…learning about race on TV.

Yes.

Or on the news, which is the worst (laughs). I learned that when I was little. They would say things about this neighborhood. I mean I was little, I would see the news, and I’d think, “That’s not right. That’s not true.”

You were lucky. You had that perception of the media as misleading when you were very young.

Yeah. I also don’t trust police officers (laughs) as much as some other white people.  (laughs). Because I know. I know that because of my white privilege and I’m pretty conforming, that I’m probably going to be okay if they’re interacting with me. Still, I do not trust that they are all good, that they’re going to always do the right thing. I just don’t; I cannot trust that. The Seattle Police… (laughs)

Garfield High. Architectural detail. Photo: Madeline Crowley ©

So, I’m glad that my son is getting this same opportunity that I had in this neighborhood. It’s just the fact that all of his friends in school are walking distance from us. When we go to the park, they see each other. It’s really easy to stop over at their house, and play in the neighborhood. The kids go down to the Dead End street here and play. Those big boys have been so good with to my kid. They stop what they’re playing and they figure out a way to include him. They’re quite a bit older and he could be bothersome to them, but they never treated him that way. They’re always, “Come play!”

They’re nice families. We’re lucky.

We are.

Thank you so much.

Special thanks to Nikki Dang Nguyet for her patience and her excellent transcription skills. 

©  Madeline Crowley People of the Central Area 2015   All material is covered by copyright. Express written permission must be given for any copyrighted material on this page. Email to request permission to copy or paste materials. 

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